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24 July 2006 @ 01:33 pm
Timelines for the anime?  
I have no idea if this has been discussed before (I'm pretty new to the series). Does anyone else notice the huge discrepancy in the passage of time between our world and Amestris at the end of the anime and in the movie? Has anyone ever tried to make a timeline for FMA?

If I'm reading things right, I guess this must mean that time is supposed to run at a different pace in our world than it does in Amestris. This is what I'm talking about ...

1910: This is when Ed and Al leave home; Ed is 12 and Al is 11.

1913-4: This is when the main events of the anime must take place, in order for ages to match up. Ed is 15 (his birthday is in the winter, I guess he would have turned 16 until the end of 1914) and Al is 14.

September 2nd, 1916: This is when episode 50, Death, takes place -- at least in OUR world. That's the date mentioned in the preview for 50, and on that day, just as shown in the series, German zeppelins bombed London (and one zeppelin was shot down -- the one that killed Alter!Ed). (More info on that here). So unless a lot more time goes by in the course of the series than it seems, and Ed is older than we think, then there's a difference in years when Ed comes out on the other side of the Gate.

Now, here's where it gets weird. During Schiezka's narration sequence, it's clear that not much time has passed (I believe she says one year? Wiki says only a few months, but I don't think that's true). So it should be 1915 (?) when Al (now 10 again, or maybe he's just turned 11) goes to train with Izumi again.

However, when we see Ed in Munich it is 1921. Maybe these two scenes aren't actually supposed to take place at the same time -- though honestly, I want to believe that Ed and Al are riding on those trains thinking of each other at more or less the same moment! ;). However, even so, that's a difference of six or seven years. The means that in the movie, Ed would have to be, like, 23 or 24 years old. Which I don't think he is.

So basically, I think that time in Amestris is supposed to go slower than it does in our world. Presumably, when Ed came through the gate a second time, several years had passed by -- it was probably around 1919.

Actually, if you take the Kids OVA into account, I think it must have been 1920 or so when he appeared again in our world -- because it's stated there that he turn 100 in 2005, which would have meant he should been born in 1905 -- and he wasn't, he was born in 1898. The only way it works out really is if he's 15 in 1920. I don't know what age Al is supposed to be in the movie ... or even a period of time is stated as having gone by since the end of the series and the beginning of the movie in Amestris, I haven't watched it thoroughly enough.

Now don't ask me to explain why there wasn't a huge gap in time during Ed's couple hours back in Amestris during the movie. *acknowledges the abundance of plot holes in the anime, but loves it too much to care*

Please tell me if I've got any of these dates or ages wrong. *_*;; I almost hope I do.
 
 
 
Kim: Ed and Denkirarakim on July 24th, 2006 06:02 pm (UTC)
Yeah time flowing at a different pace is my only explanation for the time discrepancy. This is actually sort of common in fantasy although it would have been nice for the anime producers to actually explain this and also how Ed ended up in Munich the second time instead of London (although I guess that Ed and Hohenheim could have also easily traveled to Munich from London).
It's in the trees! It's coming!thickets on July 24th, 2006 06:07 pm (UTC)
I'm definitely assuming that he first appeared in London again, and then he and Hohenheim traveled to Munich (presumably so Hohenheim could track down organization like the Thule Society in the hope that magic could get Ed home).

Maybe where the Gate shoots you out is a bit less organized. Obviously, the Gate opening in the movie was reliant on both Al and the Thule society working on both ends. Meanwhile, when Ed came to our world the first time, he was going into the waiting body of his Alterself. I don't what it was like when he arrived here the second time. He might not have even wound up with Hohenheim at first, he might have had to go find him after he got here.

*itches to write fic*

Another thing which points to the time difference which I forgot -- when Ed comes here the first time it's clear that Hohenheim has been in our world for some time already -- long enough become a close advisor to the British government and establish a friendship with Alter!Ed. And of course, he was only sent through the gate by Dante a day or two prior to Ed crossing.
Kim: Brotherskirarakim on July 24th, 2006 06:17 pm (UTC)
I read a few fics of how Hohenheim and Ed got together in our world. Usually they involved Hohenheim finding Ed but it would be interesting if it was switched the other way and it had Ed looking for Hohenheim especially in a world that he is completely unfamiliar with.
ievakaskuievakasku on July 24th, 2006 06:13 pm (UTC)
Yeah, I noticed that too; I really wish they'd explain these things. And it's not just Ed; Hoho seemed to have been there for a few years or so when Ed first got tossed through, and yet it couldn't have been more than a month since Dante sent him through. Time flow differences definitely seems like the best expanation. Either that or the Gate can throw you whenever the hell it wants too.
梅奧: Hamelm3y0 on July 24th, 2006 06:46 pm (UTC)
1898: Ed's birth
*skips a bunch of other stuff, whee!*

1614: Ed entered Old Central, and saw Dante again as Lyra.

1916: The year Ed 'lived' through in our world, at his first transfer through the gate. He is 16 years old.

1921: The gate decided it would be fun to toss him into another time period. Ed is still 16 at the end of the anime. (which would make his birthyear on Earth..1905)

Then there's the movie..
1923: Edward's 18. (Al would be about.. 12-13 in the movie.)

..and then there's the OVA
2005: Edward would be 100.

Time either runs at a different pace, or the Gate's just random.
Amberladyamber on July 24th, 2006 07:05 pm (UTC)
If you remember correctly, there's an episode where Ed reads a letter which is dated using a system based on the "Birth of Christ". It's a system not used anymore in Amestris.

So, what I figure is that there's a different date the Amestrians base their calendar on, and thus they're at the same point of time in history... just with different dating systems.

As for Ed coming through first in 1916, then in 1921, keep in mind that only Ed's soul and mind went through the first time, and they were drawn to alter!Ed's body. If alter!Ed died when zepplin'd, then it'd make sense that Ed was drawn to the year that corresponded with Amestrian time instead of the last year his alter!body was found.

Or maybe I'm just nuts. **Shrug** It's a theory, anyway.
Kasumi Lovegoodkasumicc on July 24th, 2006 07:22 pm (UTC)
The anime timeline is really messed up xD I got a headache trying to understand it...

Now, here's where it gets weird. During Schiezka's narration sequence, it's clear that not much time has passed (I believe she says one year? Wiki says only a few months, but I don't think that's true). So it should be 1915 (?) when Al (now 10 again, or maybe he's just turned 11) goes to train with Izumi again.

That's right. And one of the problems lies there: Al is 13 in the movie, and Ed is 18. So, in this moment, Al is 11, and Ed should be 17. Add the two years. Al is 13. And Ed should be 19!

1921: The gate decided it would be fun to toss him into another time period. Ed is still 16 at the end of the anime. (which would make his birthyear on Earth..1905)

That looks as a good explication...maybe for Al, it was a year; and for Ed, it was less time :P

Also, that explains the 100 years old in 2005 ^^
exfahgeek on July 25th, 2006 02:42 pm (UTC)
---quote---
That's right. And one of the problems lies there: Al is 13 in the movie, and Ed is 18. So, in this moment, Al is 11, and Ed should be 17. Add the two years. Al is 13. And Ed should be 19!
---end quote---

Actually, it's not a discrepency. At the time of Episode 51, Ed is 16 but Al has not yet had his 15th birthday - he's still 14. Here's the subsequent timeline:

Al reemerges as an amnesiac 10-year old.
Shortly after Ed's disappearance (maybe a month or so): Al has his 15th/"11th" birthday.
In late Jan/early Feb in our world: Ed has his 17th birthday.
1st year anniversary of Ed's disappearance.
Al has his 16th/"12th" birthday.
Ed has his 18th birthday.
2nd year anniversary of Ed's dissapearance.
Al has his 17th/"13th" birthday.
The events of Conquerer of Shambala occur, just over two years after Ed sacrificed himself to restore Al. The movie doesn't take place exactly two years after the end of the series; it's more like a two years and a couple of months.

Now, why does Al's birthday have to be so close to Ed's disappearance? Because when Ed and Al met Rose in Lior for the first time, Ed was 15 and Al was 14. At the end of the series, Al is still 14 - but at least nine months must have passed so Rose could get pregnant and have her baby! Even if it was born premature (at, say, eight-and-a-half months or something), she wasn't pregnant yet at the beginning of the series, and there were a number of events that took place after the birth of her baby. Therefore, the non-flashback events of the series must take place over the course of about 10 months, and Al's birthday must fall somewhere in the last two.

~ ex-FAHgeek
pikachuashnat on July 24th, 2006 07:25 pm (UTC)
It's not so much that we are ahead of time in this world or that the story has a plot hole, but the gate is random. It doesn't know time for all and only one time period. It can choose any time period. If you'll notice, Ed sees the future and the past inside of the gate. This is why he was thrown into our world in 1921.
Lorelei: Al-facesmajor_ren on July 24th, 2006 08:02 pm (UTC)
Al is always one year younger than his brother. You need to subtract 4 years off that for their journey where Al's body doesn't age. Which makes him 13 in the movie. 5 years younger than Ed or 4 years younger than Alphonse aka 'other world Al'

Though, as a second thought, there might be a flaw somewhere in this. Especially in the time difference between Amestris and our world. Well, actually, there obviously is. The fact that 5 years pass by in our world between when Dante sends Ed across the gate and when he accidentally sends himself across when bringing back Al in exchange for the past 4 years(aka Al's memories, basicly making Al's soul and mind the same age as his body). And yet, the next 3 years between 1921 and 1923 flow exactly the same in both worlds. But, this flaut isn't Arakawa sensei's, it is simply the director's need to use certain events in history the write his own ending to FMA, which we already know ISN'T Arakawa's ending by recent and past events in the manga.

So, basicly, yes. It is dramaticly flawed, but it is an anime so that's ok. Also, even the begining years are flawed. When they attempt to bring back their mother, the anime claims the year is 1910 while the manga, which having come first and in the original words of fma's creator can be called the original date, claims that the year is 1911. Of course, this extra year does not fix the flaws in dates in the anime.

Of course, Arakawa's original words -the manga- are not flawed by misguided dates. But, then again, the manga and anime are so increditably different, you can not compare their endings or any events after Greed in the slightest without horribly hurting either of the plots. Also, the events previous tho Greed don't necessarily fit either.

Now, With the listed facts above, obviously, the dates do not work and are the director's way of using historical events to shape his plot.

My advise is pretty easy to follow: ignore the errors, who cares. XD And, read the manga because the manga is fullmetal to the core.

Write back if ya have any questions. They don't call me 'fullmetalphilospher' for nothing. heh. ^^

~Major Ren-chan of RR
It's in the trees! It's coming!: FMA SuperRoythickets on July 24th, 2006 09:48 pm (UTC)
Actually, what's going on with the 1910/1911 discrepancy is that BONES rearranged the order of events. In the manga, they try to resurrect their mother and then there is a year for Ed's automail, and this is 1910. Then they come back after Ed gets his State Alcemy certification and burn the house down, and that's why in his watch in the manga says 3 Oct 11. In the anime, they condensed it, so that the day they burn the house down is 3 Oct 10. They did that with a lot of things in the anime ... for example, Tucker, Nina and the chimera experiment are supposed to take place when Ed is 15, not when he first gets to Central. (I kind of like they way they did it in the anime though.)

I basically handle the differences between the manga and the anime by thinking of the anime as an AU on a grand scale. Like, the best AU fic ever written by the biggest, most involved fans. :D So I have no problem absolutely adoring the animation while enjoying the manga too ... just like I adore "Balance of Power" by Crackbunny Syndrome as a crazy AU fic.
Loreleimajor_ren on July 24th, 2006 10:49 pm (UTC)
oh, I didn't know that. Well, XD I've been trying to make my lazy self read the begining of the manga again, It's been years, after all. Thanks.
redrose999: Ed and Squidageredrose999 on July 24th, 2006 08:30 pm (UTC)
Ed's Birth date....
Eeeek! *sweat drop* Ed was born the same year as my grandmother......

1898 Grandma Moffre

1905 Grandma Lill's birth year.

HOW wierd is that?




exfahgeek on July 25th, 2006 02:34 pm (UTC)
Also remember that Hohenheim was thrown through the gate by Dante as well, and as far as Amestrian time is concerned, that occurred no more than a few days before Dante hurled Ed through it... but Hohenheim had been in our world long enough to become an important military advisor to Winston Churchill and himself mentions that he "was wandering for quite some time."

But anyway, here's the timeline:

Amestris '16/Our world sometime before 1916: Hohenheim of Light enters our world and makes a name for himself.

Amestris '16/Our World 1916 - Ed gets chucked into our world and possesses his alternate self. A few hours later, the alternate self is killed and Ed returns to Amestris. Shortly thereafter, Ed sacrifices himself to save Al. (Ed's age: 16. Episodes 50-51)

Our world 1921 - Mysteriously, instead of dying, Ed reemerges in our world. He is reunited with Hohenheim. (Ed's age: 16. Episode 51)

Our world 1923 - The events of Conqueror of Shambala. (Ed's age: 18)

Our world 2005 (technically non-canon; at least, all the other OVA's blatantly are) - Ed's 100th Birthday


The timelines between the two worlds do not sync up at all, and it's not intended that they do.

---quote---
1910: This is when Ed and Al leave home; Ed is 12 and Al is 11.
---end quote---

Actually, they burned their house down on October 3rd '11, and Ed was 11 and Al was still 10 in the anime; Ed will have his 12th birthday on the same day as Elysia is born.

Note that this is different between the anime in the manga; in the manga, Ed was 12 when he received his state alchemy license and then returned to Resembool to burn the house down.

---quote---
1913-4: This is when the main events of the anime must take place, in order for ages to match up. Ed is 15 (his birthday is in the winter, I guess he would have turned 16 until the end of 1914) and Al is 14.
---end quote---

Ed's birthday is at the beginning of February (or possibly the end of January.) During their phone conversation on the train after Ed and Al left home just after October 3rd, Hawkeye and Hughes mention that Gracier is five months pregnant. Assuming that this is approximate (i.e. she could technically be four-months-and-three-weeks or five-months-and-two-weeks or something) and that Amestrian women have a normal human gestation period (i.e. between 37 and 40 weeks, or nine-and-a-half months), and knowing that Elysia was born a week early on Ed's birthday, there's a very narrow canon range for Ed's birthday. Incidentally, that makes Ed an Aquarius, or perhaps a tail-end Capricorn.

The main events of the series take place between the years '15 and '16 on the Amestrian calendar.

~ ex-FAHgeek
geochangeochan on October 16th, 2006 12:18 pm (UTC)
Hey guys I’ve seen many people trying to make a Fullmetal Alchemist timeline, but most of them mess up the year dates. The year dates in my timeline are very accurate…Ok here I go:
1899 – Ed is born. In Wikipedia they say he’s birthday is on February 3rd. But I don’t know if I can trust this information. All I know is that he is born in January or February… at the beginning I thought Ed is born in December 1898 but now I’m very sure he is born in the beginning of the year 1899. Now I’m talking about the timeline in anime. The things in manga are different… someday maybe I’ll make a timeline for the manga too, but not right now. Oh I forgot to mention that Winry is born in the same year as Edward.
1900 – Alphonse is born (Wiki says his birthday is on May 23rd, but I don’t know if that’s true). Edward is 1 year and a couple of months old.
1905 – The first transmutation of Ed and Al. They made a doll for Winry… but she gets scared in the process. Ed is 6 and Al is 5.
1907 – Winry parents die in the Ishvar war, killed by Mustang. Ed is 8, Al 7.
1909 – Trisha dies. Ed is 10, Al is 9.
Feb. 1910 – Ed and Al try to resurrect Trisha. Ed – 11, Al – 10.
Oct 3rd 1910 – They burn their house and leave Rizenbul.
Also Glacier, Hughes’ wife is 5 months pregnant. And the Elric brothers go and study for the exam at the Tucker residence.
1911 – On Ed’s 12th birthday, Glacier gives birth to Elysia and Ed learns he can use alchemy without a transmutation circle. Later on Edward passes the State Alchemist Qualification Exam.
Al is now 11.
1914 – Ed is 15, Al is 14. They meet Rose for the first time and a lot of stuff happens and I’m not gonna explain it ‘coz I suppose you watched the whole episodes.
1915 – Ed is 16 and I think Al is still 14 and they meet Rose for the second time and she had her first baby. But I think it’s kind of impossible for Rose to have a baby, ‘coz it’s been less than a year since she last met Ed and she wasn’t pregnant back then … probably the ones working at this anime miscalculated a little. But I don’t think many people noticed it. Or maybe I am mistaken and I miscalculated, who knows… And other things happen after that and blah blah blah.
And it comes that day when Ed is sent for the first time, by Dante, on the other side of the gate, in London 1916. Notice that in Amestris it is 1915… I’m gonna explain this thing later… And for the second time when he is sent to the other side of the gate, in our world it’s 1921 and in Amestris is still 1915. WTF? Ok now I’m gonna explain of what I thought it might happen. ‘Coz I know that you all were wondering what the hell happened. You remember when Hoho-papa, oops Hohenheim said to Alphonse if he wants to obtain what he was taken, he has to return what he was given, right? The first thing was the death of Sloth and the other thing was the 4 years Ed and Al spent traveling. When Al got his 10-year old body back and Ed reattached his soul to his body Al has forgotten everything he had learned in those 4 years. In Ed’s case it means +4 years in our world (if you know what I mean). So if we add 4 years to 1916 we get 1920. Still one year left. I got an explanation for this too. When Dante sent Hoho-papa on the other side of the gate, it’s possible that in our world and Amestris to have been the same year, 1915. We all know Hoho-papa couldn’t spend just a couple of days in our world, right? That’s the time that passed in Amestris since Hoho-papa left. And Edo-kun when he comes for the first time in our world in Alter!Ed is in 1916. And after my calculations I came to the conclusion that a year passes in our world every time Ed goes to the other side of the gate (into our world). Ed has the same age though. So now we can add one more year to 1920 and we get 1921. And a couple of months pass by since Ed has been in here and Al is now 11/15, Ed is still 16.
Ok now let’s talk about the movie timeline.
In our world is the year 1923 and in Amestris is 1917. Two years have passed since the last episode of the series. Ed is 18 and Al is 13/17. So that’s all I have to say about the movie.
About the OVA Kids (I’ve seen it):
Year 2005, in our world:
-Ed is 100 (he’s too old T_T, but I still like him)
-Al is 95/99