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12 July 2006 @ 12:14 pm
Food for thought anyone?  
SPOILERS for the end of anime/movie behind a cut!

Being a fan of Science fiction literature and FMA (The perfect combination for killing brain cells. XD), I realized a connection...

Well, first off, let's start with the butterfly theory. It was mentioned in one of Ray Bradbury's short stories from R is for Rocket, called "A Sound of Thunder".
The theory, and the story itself, explained how destructive it would be if time travelling ever became possible.

The thing is, if you went back into the prehistoric era and stepped on a bug, all the future offspring of that bug would instantly cease to exist, and that's a lot of bugs, not to mention THEIR offspring. All those bugs lost might cause a single bird to starve to death. Think about that bird's entire offspring, and all of the animals that eat that bird, and their offspring. The sudden absence of all these animals could cause, further in the future, for a caveman to starve to death. Now, what if said caveman was the ancestor of Martin Luther King Jr.? Mother Theresa? George W. Bush?

How does this connect to the FMA movie? You see, the Elric brothers were meant to stay in Amestris. They were never meant to go on our side of the gate. They went against the laws of nature, just like a time traveller would do. If this actually happened in real life, what kind of impact would they make on the world? If the Elrics spent the rest of their lives on our side of the gate, how many bugs do you think they stepped on?

Really makes you think, doesn't it? ;D
nightfireblaze: Breadanightfireblaze on July 13th, 2006 06:55 am (UTC)
So in your first paragraph your saying Ed could have transmuted Trisha's soul to the armor? @_@ That would change everything, instead of the Elric brother's running around making trouble we'd have this kid and his suit of armor mom walking around. Good thing I'm lazy or this would make an awsome crack-fic. XD
(hm wasn't there two suits of armor? Even though one wasn't full body...Ed's got two arms. XD The fullmetal family! *snaps fingers to The Adam's Family theme*)

If the Elric brothers didn't exsist and Dante did get the philosopher's stone that Scar was finishing with his killing rampage, wouldn't she just use up bodies until she couldn't last long enough to survive? Hohenhime was the one that told her why her new bodies rot so fast so she wouldn't know about why being to self obssed to realize and the only reason why Hohenhime was there in the first place was because he herd Edward talk about her. Or would she be the one to travell to the other side...?
Shark Bait: beatdowngrifstar on July 13th, 2006 08:44 am (UTC)
.... *snerk*.... Fullmetal Family....

Still Naive, Not Photogenicsliefoxx on July 13th, 2006 06:07 pm (UTC)
Or ... Edward could have sacrificed a third limb and brought both them back ... wait, you just said that. X3 Poor Hoho: "You're wife and son are suits of armor, your oldest hates you living guts, and your house was just burnt to the ground: What are you gonna do now?"

Hoho: "... well shit."

If the brothers didn't exist, Hohenheim would probably figure out that Dante was still alive and well after Lior would go up in smoke. Then again, it sounds like he didn't do much during Ishbal, so it's perfectly possible he would just let Dante go her merry way, while he let himself die this time, and until she ran out of soul to transmute.

Or Hoho could say, "Fuck you," And toss her across the gate like Envy did to himself when he jumped in ... X3

Then, there's the homunculi, who wouldn't want to die, so they would start looking for red stone ... O.o (Enter the Tringham bros and Marco, who were the only other characters who knew how to make it ...)

It could be a two parter fic! One's a crack fic with TWO suits of armor, the other everyone dies and the HOMUNCULI REIGN SUPREME.
nightfireblaze: The Sinner Ednightfireblaze on July 13th, 2006 06:20 pm (UTC)
How would that fit in two parts? In the first part which is cracky they are alive, then the second story is serious and everyone is dead. (Envy's dream come true) Wouldn't it make more sence if they were seperate fics?

If Hohenhime came back and saw his wife and younger son as suits of armor, I'd wish he'd bitch-slap Ed and use whatever was left of his philosopher's stone to give them new bodies (or at least Trisha because Al's body is in the gate).

And what about Sloth? We'd need a Trisha's soul armor! vs. Trisha's body look-alike humonculus! going on at some point. XD
Still Naive, Not Photogenicsliefoxx on July 13th, 2006 06:30 pm (UTC)
.... Good point. Two fics, makes more sense. *FacePalm*

We could make it so just a liiiiiittle of Trisha's soul was left in the gate, (POSSIBLE. Ed and Al's souls were connected in the gate!) Hoho could start emoing and want to bring Trisha back, so he goes into the gate, realizes only part of Trisha's soul is there, and attaches it to a doll of Trisha. ~.^

As for Trisha's real body ... I'm assuming the same would apply to her as it did Al, they'd just be sitting around waiting for their souls to come back. O.o
nightfireblazenightfireblaze on July 13th, 2006 06:32 pm (UTC)
But Trisha died, her body is rotting in the ground somewhere.
Still Naive, Not Photogenicsliefoxx on July 13th, 2006 06:48 pm (UTC)
... so technically they shouldn't be able to get her soul back in the first place. But it was never said that one couldn't get a soul of a dead person back from the gate ... >.O

Assuming my idea works, you're still right, Trisha will never have her real body ... unless they like, reconstructed her corpse. O.o Knowing them, totally possible ... but Sloth would still be a doll, since Sloth was only given a human body through Dante (I think. It's been a while) ... in this case, it would be Hohenheim doing the shaping.

For crack, this'll take a lot of thought ...
nightfireblaze: The Sinner Ednightfireblaze on July 13th, 2006 07:00 pm (UTC)
Didn't they see her soul within the gate? That is what Ed was reaching for when he first went in right? So it's completly possible.

Though when the soul is still waiting outside of the gate when the person first dies I think is the time that the mind is still completly intact and can return normally like Ed did for Al's sacrifice, but Trisha would have a severe memory loss if not lost her mind completly. I don't think she wouldn't have any memories though, because it is her soul, and Ed put memories into Sloth; so maybe not everything would come back to her mind but she'd have enough to identify herself with.

All this tought is just figuring out a logical way for it to happen if we were to think of how they would interact then it would be a less serious and more cracktastic disscussion.
Still Naive, Not Photogenic: Die Youngsliefoxx on July 13th, 2006 08:13 pm (UTC)
I want to say that it was Wrath who Edward saw, not Trisha. Or maybe he saw both, and it was Wrath who remembered later ...

But, Trisha's memory might be a fifty/fifty thing, since Edward remembered, but Al didn't, until his blood seal was touched by Marta's blood. I want to say that Al didn't remember anything because his body was still in the gate, so part of his soul was too, especally since in the manga, Al's body was able to talk while in the gate.

Maybe because Marta was able to 'touch up' the seal, that was enough to trigger his memory; I'm thinking, an outside force would be able to affect what happens within the Gate, like how what happens within the Gate affects the outside. (I.E, Edward and Al are connected, because for a moment, they were one inside the Gate when Ed got his soul back ... consiquently, Al's body affects Ed's, however unnoticably, with Ed's need to sleep for example.)

So, if Trisha's soul was fully tranfered to an armor, she might remember, but if part of her was left in the Gate, she probably wouldn't, until there was an outside trigger. If she did lose her memory, it would probably be to a much greater extent than Al did, because like you said, she was in there much longer ... then again, she could be like Ed, and remember everything, because she doesn't have a body in the gate.
nightfireblazenightfireblaze on July 13th, 2006 08:37 pm (UTC)
I think what Ed saw was a bit curvy to be wrath, I thought when wrath was talking about taking Ed's limbs that he was that gatebaby we had a focus on durring that flashback.

In the movie Izumi was dead and inside the gate fine, she seemed to remember wrath being her's, so maybe memory is attached to the soul, and the mind excersizes these memories, while the body stores them?
Without storage things get lost easily, but they can be recovered if you know where to look, and you won't know where to look without some sort of clue, so your right with something having to be done with to get a full (partical?) memory recap.
It would have to be something else not a bit of blood spilling on her seal, because the blood spilt on Al's seal reminded him of that night which triggered the gate memories.

I think Trisha's entire soul would go because it has nothing to attach itself to inside the gate, while a part of Al stayed in because the body was still in there.
Still Naive, Not Photogenicsliefoxx on July 13th, 2006 09:02 pm (UTC)
What episode are you talking about? 'Cause I was thinking of gate baby!Wrath, but I must be forgetting something if Trisha wasn't there after all ...

Hmm ... but memory would be part of the mind, which is different from the soul. It was explained that because Al's body was still 'living', that his mind was able to 'speak' through the armor, because his soul was attatched to it, and all three were still linked.

I'm guessing that Izumi would recognize her baby, because her mind and soul were together, but if separated she probably wouldn't have ... that storage container of her body was lost when she died, so there would be nothing linking her mind and soul together. (Also, CoS was full of plot holes, so that's probably not the best example ~.^)

If Trisha's soul was attatched to an armor, she would have no body in the gate to hold the mind, so any memory would probably be 'leftovers', like what Sloth seemed to get. A trigger might return Trisha's full memory, because those memories would have to go somewhere.

Since her soul was inside the gate, should they retrieve it, it's possible that because she would have no body to hold the mind, Trisha would be starting with a clean slate, and the mindset of an infant. Again, those leftover memories would probably give her enough knowlage to talk and function, but not enough to fully remember who she is.

Thus crack ensues, and Trisha is semi-retarded, and the boys have to reteach her everything. ^^; They go on a quest for her memories, and cliche things happen. :3
nightfireblaze: Breadanightfireblaze on July 13th, 2006 09:47 pm (UTC)
The episode I'm talking about with what Ed sees is in the begining of the series, we see him reaching out to this shiny golden silloet of a woman with wavy hair.

CoS is still canon, guess we just have to interprit what it means oursevles.

Hm didn't think about the body being needed...if any of her soul was put into Sloth, who did survive being in that state before Dante came and fed her apparently, then she could borrow Sloths brain for use. But that would complicate things because there is no way you wouldn't be able to notice something else using your own mind. Sloth would probably see what armor!Trisha is putting into it their shared mind, and could easily report to Dante what the brothers were up to. Then again it could go both ways once our now semi-retard realizes that Sloth is telling Dante current events instead of that being a weird memory.
Unless one or both can't acess each others memories, of course.

XD *dies of crack*
Meet the Elric family;
the father, Hohenhime is a drifter who left his family because he was rotting to death, literally! Being alive for 400 years does that to a person, eh?
The mother, Trisha, a semi-retarded soul trapped inside a suit of armor. She was dead for a couple of years but that's not getting into this mothers way of making sure her children are safe, do I hear mother of the year?
The elder son, Edward, he's got no arms and only one leg, but luckily for him his neighbors can attach auto-mail on him so he can have independance of his own. Though last time he acted on his own he lost his brothers entire body and most of his limbs!
The younger brother, Alphonse, yet annother member of the Elric family whom's soul is encased in an empty suit of armor, don't worry folks he apparently hadn't caught the retard desiese like his mother when put into this state!
Still Naive, Not Photogenic: *snerk* Envysliefoxx on July 14th, 2006 12:18 am (UTC)
Alphonse catch retarded from Trisha ... -snerk-

Edward: "LOOK WHAT YOU DID YOU BASTARD. Look what our family turned in to!"

Hoho: "... I didn't trans-"


Since we're going into CoS ...

Alphonse was able to talk to Edward through the gate when he put part of his soul on that armor, but his body in Amestris had been asleep, and only woke when the effect wore off. I dunno ... -shrug-, maybe Al had been using a temporary seal, since Edward's had worked for long, but not Al's.

Anyway, that would mean, Trisha's soul could share a body, but one of them would have to be unconcious at a time. I think Sloth and Trisha sharing memories would only work if part of Trisha's soul was actually in Sloth, which I don't think could happen, since you pointed out earlier that Trisha's soul would have to be completely transferred because she has no body for part of the soul to stay with.

Besides, homunculus are creatures on their own, and Sloth is only based off Trisha, memories or no. I don't think Ed put part of Trisha's soul in Sloth when he gave her memories, unless you know otherwise ... then that changes a few things. :3 Sharing a soul yes, sharing a mind, no. ^^;

Since it's a fic we can gloss over the 'lack of mind' part. ♥
nightfireblaze: Stray Dognightfireblaze on July 14th, 2006 12:59 am (UTC)
Wan't to talk more about this on msn messanger if you got it? (this would go faster) *looks at your profile* I'll add you to my contacts list if that's okay?
(no subject) - sliefoxx on July 14th, 2006 04:21 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - nightfireblaze on July 14th, 2006 04:37 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - sliefoxx on July 15th, 2006 07:45 am (UTC) (Expand)
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